Wikibooks:Requests for deletion/How to Become a Christian

How to Become a Christian
This does not seem to be informational. No matter what one's religious beliefs, this seems to lean strongly towards opinion and advocacy for a belief. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 59.92.94.254 (talk • contribs).


 * Delete - Upon review of this page, I would have to agree that this page is hopelessly in violation of NPOV standards and irredeemable to be fixed up with simple editing. A Wikibook about the process of becomming a Christian IMHO can be done with NPOV standards, but this book is far too soapboxish to achieve that result.  It certainly advocates a very strong point of view.  --Rob Horning 14:33, 8 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete- Even though there is religious freedom, and person who wrote this book has the freedom to make this book, it seems a little bit aggessive and closed-minded toward other people. Also it could be a convertisal book, and might be vandalized a lot. --German Men92 01:54, 9 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete'- NPOV issues  --Gabe Sechan 04:29, 9 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep'- The subject matter is true to its content: it details how to become a Christian and deals simply with that. The comment that it is discriminating other people is unrational - the subject matter caters specifically to one sole people, sinners. There are no words of aggression - the article only bears hope. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Isaac (talk • contribs) 04:52, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
 * As a fellow Christian, I think the message of hope and salvation is a good one that I would like to preach as the Master said. However, this is a point of view and Wikibooks is not a pulpit for proclaiming the gospel of Jesus.  There are other websites, even Wikis, that can be used to proclaim messages of this nature.  See Christian wikis for a whole bunch of potential sites where this can be mirrored to where not only will the message be recieved gladly, but the NPOV standards don't apply either.  The aggressive behavior is zeal and enthusiasm for the word of Christ, not that the content is threatening bodily harm to anybody who disagrees.  A scholarly book about Jesus that tries to objectively look at his life is acceptable on Wikibooks... as long as it includes other points of view including those who think the death of Jesus was rigged and faked.  And rebuttals to that viewpoint and other ideas.  A Neutral Point of View can sometimes be very difficult to achieve with content like this, which is why many rounds of editing often occur when topic like this come up.  --Rob Horning 05:57, 9 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete or Move offsite – Quote: "What must I do to be saved?" "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved"! There is God's plan of salvation, the only plan He has for every man, woman and child who was ever born into the whole world. Compare with WB:WIW. Is there somewhere to which we can move the text? http://pbwiki.com? http://editthis.info? http://seedwiki.net? http://wikispaces.com? --Kernigh 05:37, 9 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete. Exist solely to push a POV.  --JMRyan 10:10, 9 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep'- It may seem strong or aggressive, but that doesn't make it incorrect or worthy or censorship! If someone doesn't want to learn how to become a Christian, then they don't have to read it.  If they are sincerely interested, then this is a great resource!  Since sites like this promote an open exchange of ideas, opposing views are welcome. --Jason


 * Delete It's an essay, not suitable for Wikibooks. --Derbeth talk 16:35, 10 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete Kellen T 11:13, 16 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep It is a noble thing to read about God's words —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.163.240.190 (talk • contribs).
 * This comment/vote was previously added to the bottom (below "Humor") without the boldface "Keep" vote but rather under the separate heading "Keep", see . I moved it here and converted it to a proper vote because that is what appears to have been intended.  My own vote above still stands.  --JMRyan T E C 12:33, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
 * How d'ya know the person who added that note didn't think humour was God's words? ;-) BD2412 T 13:34, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

"Oh, I beg you, see it today! You are a poor, lost sinner, a Hell-bound sinner!"
 * Neutral I dunno much on this one. The whole "How to become a Christian" concept is alright, but the book in its current form appears to push you to become Christian in the first place. I also was expecting to see some more technical stuff; like the RCIA (Rite of Chritian Initiation for Adults, the Catholic initiation ritual) or the equivalent for other Christians. I see potential in the book; but not in its current form. --Dragontamer 05:15, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Changed vote to Heavy Cleanup. Regardless of the current vote, it seems a general concensus that this book doesn't have a NPOV. I suggest a heavy cleanup instead of delete; because I see potential in the book, and a book on how to become a Catholic is useful indeed. I suggest to the author, focus more on technical issues on becoming a Christian. Example: Write a chapter on how to become a Roman Catholic, which involves issues like: what time of year the RCIA takes place, finding a sponsor, researching for your patron Saint, studying some scriptures, and so on and so forth. If any other Christian initiation (for say, a Baptist) was half as complex, a book can easily be written on that subject :P --Dragontamer 16:10, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Comment - this book itself presents a very narrow view on "how to become a Christian" - certainly there are groups who have equally legitimate views that becoming a Christian requires additional (or even contradictory) actions, or may be as simple as declaring faith even without bothering to study the Bible, etc. If this article is kept, it should express all different views of how to become a Christian. Of course, language suggesting that one must be a Christian to be saved must be clarified as speculation, else we will have books on "how to become a Muslim", "how to become a Jew", "how to become a Mormon", and so forth each saying that theirs is the only path to salvation (or more abstractly, how to become a Pantheist, a Pandeist, a Deist, a Polytheist, maybe a Communist, etc...). BD2412 T 13:39, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Delete This is clearly POV. Aside from the obvious pushing of the Christian POV, with wreckless disregard for any other religion, this is also clear POV-pushing for a particular flavor of Christianity (Baptist-esque). Certainly, the section on good works not mattering would not appeal to a Catholic, and yet the Catholic POV is not even alluded to. This article is POV, and even the people above who have voted for Keep do not dispute it. They simply claim that it's "valuable" for unknown reasons and give horrid excuses like "it's a noble thing" -- if we suddenly allow that explanation to permit this POV essay, we have to do it for every POV essay (see slippery slope). I'll leave you with this great quote from the article:
 * Strom 16:37, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

''Deleted. Rounded out, 80% voted delete, exact 77%, also is breaking policy of NPOV.''--German Men92 01:08, 29 April 2006 (UTC)