User talk:DonaldKronos

So, why doesn't the Sandbox have some simple instructions in it like to let people know whether or not others see their changes, whether there is a way to start your own "personal" Sandbox, how and why to revert it, and stuff like that?

Why does this whole thing seem to be set up to chase away new users? Are people not welcome here unless they're part of a clique?


 * Hi, the appropriate place for general question is one of the the "forums" in the Reading_room . :) In general all changes are visible to all users on wikibooks. Public sandboxes are only for very quick tests and are shared by everyone. You can always create new pages below your user page where it is unlikely that other people will do any edits. --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 16:44, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

= INTRODUCTION =

Hi. This is Donald Arthur Kronos. I have plans to do some writing on WikiBooks, so I thought I would start here on the page about myslef, to get a feel for how this works. I've been known for many years on the Internet as TechnoZeus and I considered choosing that as my username here, but the name tends to get copied by people who like it or think doing so is honoring me in some way, so I decided to go with username DonaldKronos here because I can't imagine anyone else wanting it. :)

We'll see how this actually turns out, but I plan to start off with a few small additions to one or more existing books on Cellular Automata and then to begin work on my own textbook on the Esper' language. I'm also considering writing a bit on spirituality, as a separate topic from religion or mysticism, from my own perspective, although I have not yet decided on a format and I'm not yet sure if it would be appropriate for this site.

If anyone out there reading this has any good acting roles to offer me, please e-mail me. I'm not above spending my life in selfless service to others, but our society is currently geared toward having to earn the right to survive in more selfish ways, so I have to keep that in mind as well.

Edit: I misunderstood the purpose of this page, so this introduction should probably have gone on my User page at User:DonaldKronos but I'll leave it here, as a "discussion starter", and I have added a link on that page to this one. -- Donald Arthur Kronos

template sandbox
Hi, after working with the template sandbox, please reset it to its original state. Thanks --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 08:04, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

How in the world do you RESPOND in here?

I would like to thank Martin for the message.... I wondered about that, but the Sandbox kept getting reset while I was using it, so I figured it might be resetting itself. No way to ASK anyone, unfortunately. :(

I found Martin's User page, and discussion page, but nothing that looks like a proper place to leave a message. :( Anyone care to fill me in on how such things work in here?

Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 10:47, 3 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Hi, you usually respond to comments on talk or discussion pages by writing your response (indented with ":") beneath the text that you respond to. This is the same as on wikipedia and therefore this kind of information might be hard to find because historically almost all contributors to wikibooks were familiar with wikipedia. --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 16:32, 3 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Thanks. (That reply is from Martin, right? I thought it was from Xania at first... because I got an e-mail notification saying that Xania had modified my page.) That's VERY helpful information, and much appreciated. But how will that person find the "reply"? Or is there simply no such thing as a reply in here and rather just edits, deletions, and aditions? These would be good things to know, going forward. Also, two other things... What are the stuff in square brackets at the end of what you wrote (automatic, custom, etc.) and how do I get the restriction on page creation started so that I can begin implementing the parts of the book I've been working on? I've been going over the parts of it offline because I didn't know if it's okay to "edit in place" as one works out the details... and such information is probably also embedded in a long standing community most of which has simply migrated or extended into this new domain, but I think it's important that the community be allowed to grow from outside as well or it will likely eventually stagnate. 76.168.173.3 (discuss) 00:20, 4 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, I've written it (as indicated by the signature); Xania's comment is below. People will find the replies in the same way as you found Xania's comment, and in general by looking at their watchlist. And, yes, in some sense there are no replies but just edits. The stuff in square brackets is the signature of the comment (you can create it with --~ ). The restriction on page creation will be lifted automatically after a week or so, as far as I know. --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs)


 * A week? Really? By then someone will probably delete my book, because my progress on it has been basically halted by the restriction. :( No way to win in here, huh? Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 08:16, 5 January 2013 (UTC)


 * I guess you are not assumed to start new books before you understand the basics of wikibooks. In my experience that takes more than a week. ;) --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 13:54, 5 January 2013 (UTC)


 * Sounds like a good way to keep people who could potentially benefit the community from getting started in here. If that's not the intention, perhaps they should consider a more "welcome" policy. Just my opinion. Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 11:13, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

Help
I noticed your recently created page, Esper. I have put a Query template on the page so that other's may help if you need it. The page won't be deleted straight away as I know you're working on it. If you need any help leave a message on my Talk page or contact another active editor.--ЗAНИA talk 22:53, 3 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Nice to know that it won't be deleted "straight away" although that's not real reassuring since the restriction placed on me is keeping me from making the progress I had PLANNED, and "eventually deleting it" after I have worked hard on it for a long time doesn't exactly sound like it would be a nice thing. 76.168.173.3 (discuss) 00:29, 4 January 2013 (UTC)


 * I think what Xania is refering to is that it is unclear what "Esper" is. For example, if you (DonaldKronos) have invented Esper, the page will probably be considered to describe original research and therefore will probably be deleted because this is not allowed on wikibooks (see OR). --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 08:20, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Donald, thanks for the message on my talk page. You are correct - messages on talk pages should go at the bottom of the page.  Using the Add Topic button will do much the same thing automatically.  I see you have made some progress with the book.  don't be off put by the 'Original Research' template that I have put at the top of the page.  I added it there so that you could read the description of original research and fix anything which might make it less original.  I may be wrong (often happens) but I couldn't really find any other references to Esper language on the Internet.--ЗAНИA [[Image:Flag_of_Estonia.svg|15px]]talk 12:21, 4 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It's a variation of the Esperanto language. There have been many over the years, usually made to favor people who already know some specific language or a language from a specific area... which is about the opposite of Esper', which is a generalized version of Esperanto. Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 08:20, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Donald, I've read in the Esper wikibook that the creator of Esper doesn't want to be revealed. This is not good. Are there any published resources about Esper? If not, I would recommend that you stop developing that book on Wikibooks because you won't be able to prove that it is not original research. The lack of published resources about a topic is probably reason enough to assume that it original research. --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 18:18, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It's not that the creator of Esper' wishes to be kept anonymous. (That would be me.) It's simply that the Esper' language is "public domain" and the creator of the language wishes to allow the public to participate in the creation of a textbook on the subject so that it can be less biased, and that WikiBooks has certain policies in place to keep people from using the site for self publicity and such, which the creator of the Esper' language fully understands and agrees with. I have seen various web pages on the Esper' language over the years, but they tend to vanish. I have been told by the authors of several of them that they seem to simply vanish, and I suspect there is something political involved... so if the people in charge of WikiBooks do not wish this gift to be shared with the public, they are of course free to make the book disappear, but I am hoping that they will be nicer to society than that and will allow it to grow. Oh, and yes, it has been published. Some of that has mysteriously vanished as well, but some of it remains. I'm hoping that people will add links to their own Esper' pages or those they feel are good reference sources as time goes by, but the Esper' language supports spoken Esperanto and the full Esperanto vocabulary, so links to Esperanto pages may also be added where appropriate. In the mean time, I'll keep working on getting it "presentable" and hopefully the day will come when I can simply leave it in the hands of the people. Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 08:24, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, in case the book is suggested for deletion, you should be prepared to present some of those links and/or references. Otherwise it would look like a clear case of original research. --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 14:04, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

Errors
Lately I get nothing but errors when I try to edit Esper or Esper/Word_Lists and I have no idea how to report the errors, so I decided to put them here. I hope that's okay. I also hope I made those links right just now. Anyway, if anyone sees this and knows how to let the right people know about it, please do. I have been trying to edit Esper so that I can replace the tables in the Word Lists section with a link to the new Word Lists page I was finally able to create, and I also need to update the Word_Lists page, where I would like to put an index to separate lists based on prefixes and so on. Anyway, here's some text from one error I got just recently...

If you report this error to the Wikimedia System Administrators, please include the details below. Request: GET http://en.wikibooks.org/w/index.php?title=Esper/Word_Lists&action=edit, from 76.168.173.3 via cp1012.eqiad.wmnet (squid/2.7.STABLE9) to 10.64.0.130 (10.64.0.130) Error: ERR_READ_TIMEOUT, errno [No Error] at Thu, 17 Jan 2013 16:21:05 GMT

and here's some from another...

A database error has occurred. Did you forget to run maintenance/update.php after upgrading? See: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Upgrading#Run_the_update_script Query: UPDATE `user` SET user_touched = '20130117195521' WHERE user_id = '849612' AND (user_touched < '20130117195521') Function: User::invalidateCache Error: 1205 Lock wait timeout exceeded; try restarting transaction (10.0.6.44)

and here's the full text of the one I got just before I opened this to start writing it, starting here...

WIKIMEDIA FOUNDATION Error Our servers are currently experiencing a technical problem. This is probably temporary and should be fixed soon. Please try again in a few minutes.

You may be able to get further information in the #wikipedia channel on the Freenode IRC network.

The Wikimedia Foundation is a non-profit organisation which hosts some of the most popular sites on the Internet, including Wikipedia. It has a constant need to purchase new hardware. If you would like to help, please donate.

If you report this error to the Wikimedia System Administrators, please include the details below. Request: GET http://en.wikibooks.org/w/index.php?title=Esper&action=edit, from 76.168.173.3 via cp1010.eqiad.wmnet (squid/2.7.STABLE9) to 10.64.0.130 (10.64.0.130) Error: ERR_READ_TIMEOUT, errno [No Error] at Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:03:20 GMT

...and ending there.

Okay, that's it for now. I'm at a loss as to what I should do. Can't even undo and start from a previous state... they're both completely uneditable. :(

Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 20:16, 17 January 2013 (UTC)


 * I don't remember the recommendation but a single wikimedia page should definitely never be larger than 100,000 bytes. I think the recommendation is much lower (something like 32,000 bytes because some web browers won't allow you to edit longer pages; I was once strongly criticized for a page of about 60,000 bytes). The wikimedia software is simply not designed to deal with pages of much more than 32,000 bytes. You have to split those pages into smaller pages (if it is a list of words, you could try one page for each letter of the alphabet). By the way, the use of templates helps but doesn't solve the problem because internally the page is still expanded and again the wikimedia software is not designed to deal with pages that expand to very large pages. (Also, it would make more sense to post this kind of technical question to the reading room instead of your user page.) --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 18:05, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I did manage to work around the problem. Opened a small section and deleted that section.... them I was able to edit again. Thanks. Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 12:52, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

A few of the pages you have created are rather big. They are taking a long time to load in my web browser (both Opera and Chrome). It seems to be just the amount of text and templates rather than the physical size of the page. An example is Esper/Conjugating suffixes. Maybe consider using fewer templates or splitting content between pages.--ЗAНИA talk 09:51, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for letting me know, but I'm not sure what I can do. There's no templates at all on that page. It's a list of Esper' words fitting a certain description. I'm attempting to create a serious open textbook here, as it is my understanding that this is the purpose of WikiBooks. I hope software limitations don't get in the way too much. :/ Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 12:52, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
 * As far as I could tell the whole page was templates - all of the words are contained within collapsible templates. I was just visiting the pages to review recent changes.  I am not able to review changes to this book any longer as it crashes my web browser - I presume it is also causing problems to yours and other peoples?--ЗAНИA [[Image:Flag_of_Estonia.svg|15px]]talk 17:51, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It was on mine, but I managed to clear it up. I'll continue to look for ways I can make improvements. But no, the collapsible tables are coded directly on the pages rather than in a template. I had created templates for the purpose, but then I got restricted and could not create the pages to put them on, so I went ahead with the work of creating the tables WITHOUT the aid of templates. I'll add a warning that the pages are somewhat large, before the links to them within the book. (Is there a template for that?) Also, I plan to make some shorter lists which will not need such a warning, but I'm still working out the details on what's best to put in them, based on planned lessons and sections so far and adjustments I have made to the plan based partially on such limitations. Donald Arthur Kronos, Ph.D. -- Actor, Activist -- One of many working hard to make the world better for everyone! (discuss • contribs) 08:54, 20 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The page Esper/Conjugating suffixes is currently more than 1,000,000 bytes large. Again: my recommendation is to keep it below 100,000 bytes (better: below 32,000 bytes). For example, you could have one page for each of the conjugating suffix. Don't think of wikipages as chapters but as small sections. --Martin Kraus (discuss • contribs) 14:09, 20 January 2013 (UTC)

RFD
I see there's been a nomination for deletion at WB:RFD. --Pi zero (discuss • contribs) 10:01, 3 August 2015 (UTC)