User talk:Atcovi/Archive 3

Accidental Edit in Class Project
Hi Atcovi, I was hoping you could help. I am part of a class project on 'Perspectives of Digital Media/ The Prosumer Society, and a member has accidentally took out 3694 characters of my groups work at 12:11pm. I think it was to do with him not being on the most updated version of the wikibook and when he has made an edit, he has accidentally removed people's work who have previously added something before him in the process of adding his contribution. By the looks of it, it looks like it has been approved, however I hoping, if it is possible, if you could perhaps undo the edit as some of us have lost our work and are on a strict deadline and would be a huge help. Thanks, and I look forward to your reply :) KelseyB20 (discuss • contribs) 15:39, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
 * User:KelseyB20 - Is this the revision? https://en.wikibooks.org/w/index.php?title=Perspectives_in_Digital_Culture/The_Prosumer_Society&diff=2774238&oldid=2774216 --atcovi (talk) 15:55, 4 March 2015 (UTC)


 * atcovi - Yes that's the one! I think we've managed to sort it out now anyway, but thank you for your help :)! KelseyB20 (discuss • contribs) 16:11, 4 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Indeed, I've already seen your classmates restoring the content one hand at a time. No problem, contact me if you need any help btw :-) --atcovi (talk) 16:17, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

Full protection of userpage
Just an FYI - full page protection should really only be used in cases of repeated vandalism, to prevent problematic page creations or to prevent edits to a high value template. You should probably familiarize yourself with the policy page here: WB:PP and always ensure that you include a summary on why you are applying the protection to a page. --Az1568 (discuss • contribs) 00:33, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks Az. I'll be sure to read it. --atcovi (talk) 00:34, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Do you really need full protection of your userpage? At best, autoprotect it. Is this the convention when someone becomes an admin by any chance?--Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 20:03, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * @Leaderboard Generally, most userpages do not require protection and becoming an admin does not change that. --Az1568 (discuss • contribs) 00:58, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Administrator
Congratulations! --Abd (discuss • contribs) 18:12, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks Abd :-) --atcovi (talk) 19:10, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

From me also. --Pi zero (discuss • contribs) 19:44, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Haha thanks Pi zero ;) --atcovi (talk) 19:52, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Take it from me as well.--Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 20:03, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks. And thanks for joining Wikijunior:Asia, it's appreciated! ^-^ --atcovi (talk) 20:05, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that. My intention is for India, since that's what I know more of.--Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 11:18, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Congratulations on your promotion to First Class Janitor administrator! ;) '''Jianhui67 talk ★ contribs 11:33, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Sure is fun :p --atcovi (talk) 11:41, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

What's up?
After you're an admin, this?

''At this time I'm having a discussion with my family members about my wikiediting. They're currently discussing whether they should add a filter and block me from editing. I may not come back for months. If I meet the admin demotion criteria, feel free to demote me, but please don't demote me right away, since I may have time to edit. Thanks!''

What does this mean? Something to do with adminship?(Quite a sudden warning) --Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 11:47, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Sure is, and I'm very disappointed to post that message, especially after only two days of job duty. After my sysop request was done and I got the mop, I was moderating Wikibooks way more than I did before as only a reviewer. This got on my father's nerves and blocked Wikibooks from the home computer. I'm using the school computer to type this message/edit Wikibooks and as well as deletions/blocks and other administrative duties. My father, today, is planning on talking to my principal about Wikibooks and me "abusing" it. Wikibooks is actually educational and (at class) we use Wikibooks for educational reasons. I honestly doubt that Wikibooks will be blocked on my school computer, but that chance is a 50. --atcovi (talk) 11:58, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Or, they'll ask you to relinquish your adminship? I do not know myself though.--Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 12:10, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I would recommend you simply slow down or reduce your activities - say maybe just do stuff at the weekends. There's no need to be super-active either as an editor or an administrator. When real life is no longer a problem (even if it is 3 years away) then you can do more. Nobody will be de-admining you unless you are completely inactive as both editor and admin for a year. QuiteUnusual (discuss • contribs) 12:14, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * @Leaderboard - No, they're blocking Wikibooks to prevent me from editing/administrator duties.
 * @QuiteUnusual - I understand, they're not giving me a second chance. I understand that real life comes first, even if I try slowing down, they're not going to decide to unblock the filters that block here. They just hate it during my free time that I'm editing here, they think I'm "wasting time" going here and learning nothing, which I find is absurd. --atcovi (talk) 12:24, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * That's a real shame. I've learnt so many things here, and at Wikipedia. Even doing basic maintenance forces you into contact with subjects you would never have otherwise encountered. The process of writing and editing is hugely educational in formal English skills. And finally the work of an administrator forces you to develop judgement, handle difficult people, face conflict and so on. It's probably pointless but if you think an email to your school or parents would help, then drop me a note via "Email this user" and I'd be happy to send something to you (to forward) or direct to them laying out the benefits and also providing links to some of the material the Wikimedia Foundation produces. Good luck. QuiteUnusual (discuss • contribs) 12:47, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I'll be more than happy to notify you if I need an email. Thanks. --atcovi (talk) 13:22, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Atcovi, I was referring about your school , not your parents(you've told us already about them).
 * An unrelated question, can you or any other editor explain how Wikibooks is used in your school and how you are able to do admin work in your school(nothing like that here)?
 * As for @QuiteUnusual, you're right as to what you are saying.--Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 15:13, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * User:Leaderboard - Well I have a few minutes here to explain to you how I'm able to edit/do my administrative duties. The other, if I have time, I'll explain.
 * We have this period, after the first class, called "Directed Study", where we are allowed to do something educational, not play games. I use this 30 minutes to edit/check up on Wikibooks. And as well as free time (which are usually for a few minutes) in my seven classes I have. It isn't necessarily hard to get time to check up on Wikibooks at my school. --atcovi (talk) 15:33, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Is your school fully digitised? Seriously, what you're saying makes me think that you have full internet access in you school and in your class? Please do explain , I do not know much myself.--Leaderboard (discuss • contribs) 17:13, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, we have full internet access in our school and in our class. That isn't much to explain I believe. --atcovi (talk) 19:36, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * From the sound of it (I seriously lack actual context, of course), Wikibooks would seem an above-board legitimate use of "directed study" time; but I'd recommend taking it easy on use of free time in other classes for Wikibooks. My own experience from school is that switching topics again and again gets wearing, and with about half a dozen classes it's probably best not to also be bouncing in and out of Wikibooks mode; the better to process your classes.  Though different people's mental processes can vary enormously so YMMV.  --Pi zero (discuss • contribs) 20:20, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I usually use Wikibooks after a test/quiz something like that. --atcovi (talk) 20:25, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
 * User:QuiteUnusual - User:Leaderboard: It seems that my father is giving me a last chance, and so forth I have decided to spend a lot of wiki editing time during the weekends, but edit a couple of times from Monday-Friday. It seems that he's giving me a chance and said to slow down on the editing. He still finds Wikibooks a waste of time, but he's still going to allow me to edit. Seems like the issue has been taken cared of and I have removed the notice on my userpage. --atcovi (talk) 21:56, 13 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Well congrats on the one hand, and Ouch on the family tension, you might want to point out to Dear Old Dad that being accepted as an admin is a fairly large accomplishment, even in the real world.


 * Thanks for the Speedy-D's on the other, but as an older guy with two now just out of college, I can appreciate how Wikis can alarm your parents. I suggest Plato's and Socrates admonition (adopted as well by Ben Franklin's Poor Richard) - avoid excesses in everything and strive for balance through moderation in everything. (paraphrased I'm sure) You might try a counter strategy-bug him when you know he's into something by asking for advice on this or that, etc. or ask him to go jogging or play tennis because you're worried about his health, etc. (Trust me, we all need more exercise- I'm recovering from a bad accident, and it's amazing how weak muscles get so very rapidly in a long hospital stay. And consider, he might be complaining because he'd rather have more togetherness time, which should be a good thing and will make for special memories for both of you, unless he's a real jerk (and his parenting concerns suggest otherwise. I know as I came to grips with my boys nearing college, I wanted to spend a lot more time with them-they'd learned enough to be interesting by then you see, and the pending loss was suddenly a burden! So recognize the Love that could be in the mix too!)


 * Again thanks and best wishes, perspective is one thing schools cannot well teach, and few try - alas, it comes from being burned by making mistakes all too often! // Fra nkB 08:09, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks anew for the (new) speedy Speedy-D's! // Fra nkB 03:03, 22 March 2015 (UTC)
 * No problem! --atcovi (talk) 13:53, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

markup
Btw, you can generate

with markup

Personally, I prefer using the  magic word because then I'm not hardwiring the protocol and site name into it and I can use the normal name of the page. --Pi zero (discuss • contribs) 17:11, 24 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I'll check that out soon, thanks. --atcovi (talk) 20:15, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

User book
Hi. I've got a request, and some background comments.


 * Short version:
 * I'd like to set up the user book template customization using the internal arrangment I'd meant it to use when I created the template. This would involve tweaking the markup on your user page a bit; it shouldn't make any visible difference to your user page.  It seemed like it'd be a little high-handed to just do it (on the principle it's easier to ask forgiveness than permission), especially since you fully protected your user page.  May I proceed?


 * Long version:
 * Several years ago, I had this idea for a little thing that seemed like it might help promote community spirit on Wikibooks. My idea was to have a really easy-to-use template called user book that any user could put on their user page with a parameter naming a wikibook, and it would automatically create this nifty userbox saying that user contributes to that book.  The trick to it, technically, was to arrange that the user book could be customized on a per-book basis, in a way that the central template user book would automatically find and use if it existed.


 * I solved the immediate technical problem. The template is really easy to put on a user page.  In theory the customization is fairly easy too: you just create a template page with a certain name, calling a certain helper template, with a bit of overhead markup and then whatever customizing parameters you want to sepcify for that book.  That's in theory.  In practice it's a bit confusing to set up.


 * That got me to thinking. There are lots of things on the wikis that work if you know to do them the way they're meant to be done, but over time the people who know how either forget or move on, and other people come along who don't know, and learning all this stuff about everything you work with could be a full-time career.  Not just specialized technical stuff like this.  Everything.  Working on three different sisters ('pedia, 'books, and 'news) I've seen about four or five different ways of archiving a discussion thread, several different ways of setting up a nomination for something, and scads of different ways for a content page to be organized: off hand I can think of at least three different kinds of articles on Wikipedia that are arranged differently, five different kinds of Wikinews articles (well, I do spend most time there), and really each wikibook has its own idiosyncracies.  And there's a huge problem with how to you capture this knowledge from the people who know, and put it in a form so that it's right there at any user's fingertips when they want to apply it.  If you asked the Foundation to do this, they'd hire a pile of programmers and create a system that has to be maintained by them that does what they thought you told them needed doing to help with the tasks they thought you told them needed helping with.  But what if you could add just a few simple, carefully very general additional capabilities to wiki markup.  Say, the ability to specify "put a text input box here", and "put a button here that, when pressed, takes the contents of such-and-such input boxes and passes the information to that page over there".  Once you had those low-level capabilities, it might enable ordinary wiki users to directly create interactive asisstants &mdash; basically wizards &mdash; to do anything that the wiki users wanted to do.  Because really, when you think about it, creating those wizards is something that should be crowdsourced to the community, who are the ones who have the knowledge, just like they're the ones who have the content knowledge.


 * I've actually figured out the first part of this, how to add the low-level capabilities. I've been working on implementing it for several years on Wikinews, and am almost satisfied with it enough to port it to Wikibooks.  n:Help:Dialog.  Admittedly, one thing I haven't had the chance to do is test it on a mobile platform.


 * The second stage is figuring out how to use those low-level capabilities. I suspect that's a never-ending process.  I've only gotten a small start on it so far, at n:Wikinews:Assistant.


 * Semi-ironically, along the way I've also gotten better at the sort of customization I dabbled in with user book. I've recently created a somewhat similar template on wikinews, n:Template:Infobox, that takes a category as a parameter and gets its customizations from a wikitable, such as n:Template:Infobox/lookup/France.


 * Meanwhile, though, for now, I'd like to shift around the user book customizations for Wikijunior:Asia/Africa. :-) --Pi zero (discuss • contribs) 13:13, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Do what you think is best Pi zero, I trust your judgement! --atcovi (talk) 19:42, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Wikijunior:Asia header template
I've created a header template for Wikijunior:Asia, Template:Wikijunior:Asia/Header. Check it out at Wikijunior:Asia/China. I've added it there and to Bangladesh, but I'll hold off on adding it on other pages until I've heard your thoughts on it. Currently it just adds a globe with the location of the country (using globe which I created) on the left, and the flag and the name on the right. I made the background a blue gradient, but I'm not sure it looks right. Since you created the book, it's up to you how to format it, or whether we need one at all. I've set up header so that it implements per-book header templates if they exist, along the lines of what PiZero has been doing with templates like User book, so the Wikijunior:Asia header can be called using simply. Anyway, let me know what you think when you've got a chance. Liam987 talk 21:34, 20 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Liam987, the template seems great to me, thanks for the additions. --Atcovi (talk ↔ contribs) 00:50, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

Recent blocks
Hey Atcovi, I just wanted to take a quick moment to point out some concerning issues with your recent blocks.


 * 01:14, April 23, 2015 Atcovi (discuss | contribs | block) blocked 213.205.252.240 (discuss) with an expiry time of 1 year (account creation disabled) (vandalism) (unblock | change block)
 * So it's typically not appropriate to block an IP for an entire year for just simple vandalism... I've gone ahead and and adjusted the timeframe on that to about ~1 month.


 * 11:46, April 22, 2015 Atcovi (discuss | contribs | block) blocked Celliott74 (discuss | contribs) with an expiry time of indefinite (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own discussion page) (Spambots) (unblock | change block)
 * In this case, you indefinitely banned a contributor to the KS3 Computing Wikibook, who ended up having to send an email to our info@undefinedwikibooks.org OTRS address to get her account reinstated. This is extremely concerning as it seems that you did not review the contributions of this user before placing the block. If you had done so, you would have seen that they were in fact not a spambot. All I ask is that you just please be more careful... and even slow down a little if needed. Thanks! --Az1568 (discuss • contribs) 05:00, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Eeeh... Thanks for clearing that up Az, I'll be more patient and reviewing through blocks. Thanks. --Atcovi (talk ↔ contribs) 09:31, 23 April 2015 (UTC)