Talk:Plato

Each individual perceives themselves according to their own light. This is how we define ourselves.

The danger of repeating the claim that Plato has given us in the character of Socrates a window to the mind of Socrates can be easily dismissed just on the opening of this discussion. Plato was Plato.

To illustrate the danger of accepting information from those we place on an academic pedestal I submit the Leibniz/Newton controversy. Newton did not invent calculus - it was Leibniz. In England, my country, most people think it was Newton. The Germans know it was their man Leibniz. Is it any wonder these two nations are at each others throats. There are countless instances where the greatest minds have stolen, lied, fought duels to the death, all in the name of truth. Yet the truth of the Leibniz/Newton controversy is visible to all to see yet it is still called a controversy.

I propose that we have no way of knowing if Plato was sticking the proverbial knife into Socrates back after he was dead. Using Socrates as a character may be nothing more than Plato saying "the stupid jerk deserved it but I am going to make sure it doesn't happen to me". I'm always surprised at how willingly people accept Plato's works as a sign of his love and friendship for Socrates. To cut a long discussion short - it is the words of Plato we are reading. If we are to take Newton's statement that he had invented calculus in his head years before he had wrote it down then we must also ask "why was it your memory suddenly sprang into action after Leibniz had published his calculus".

If you can't see anything fishy in this then I doubt you will see anything fishy in Plato using Socrates.

One last exampleː

King Henry IIː "will no-one rid me of this troublesome priest?"

Knights of the King ride off to Canterbury and kill Thomas Becket, Archbishop of Canterbury.

The population are outraged.

King Henry IIː "Damn now I'm in trouble with the commoners. I know how to fool the stupid people and rid myself of any blame in the murder of my ex-friend. I will go to Canterbury and prostrate myself at the spot he was murdered and express my remorse to the assembled Bishops who will be so scared of the same thing happening to them that they will go along with anything."

The above is my account of the murder of Thomas Becket. I don't really know what King Henry said but I doubt it was sincere. The same pinch of salt must be applied to Plato's Apologia - after all he was related to the people who sentenced Socrates to death.

Sluffs (discuss • contribs) 01:15, 29 September 2016 (UTC)