Talk:Issues in Interdisciplinarity 2020-21/Truth in Euthanasia

Possible plan of the research

 * 1) Introduction
 * 2) Different truth within the disciplines
 * Legislative truth
 * Medical truth
 * Ethical truth
 * 1) Interdisciplinary response to euthanasia
 * 2) Conclusion

Assignment marking summary

 * “You should look to identify an example of a problem or question that has been approached from different disciplinary perspective” = we need to remember about the interdisciplinary perspective


 * “Then, you should look to identify some tension between those different disciplinary perspectives.” = The suggestion from our last meeting to find “bridges or “contrasts” was correct. After our initial research, we should discuss how to identify the “tension” between law, ethics and medicine.

Word count: 1200 words (references & image captions are not included).

Deadline: 5pm 14th December (Monday)

Content (50%):
 * “You will need to be extremely precise” ✓
 * Identify tension = “identifying where people working in one discipline fail to agree with people working in another discipline” ✓

Writing (10%):
 * short, clear sentences ✓
 * simple words and phrases ✓
 * explain specialist terminology ✓

Research and referencing (10%):
 * how to reference in Wikitext ✓
 * high-quality source ✓

Contribution (30%):
 * individual’s contribution ✓
 * regular, thoughtful, precise and relevant ✓
 * include attendance list and notes from meetings ✓

--Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:09, 29 November 2020 (UTC)


 * another point that was highly recommended: include pictures, drawings or any kind of visuals to illustrate our ideas. ✓ --Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 20:25, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Books

 * Book : Euthanasia and Law in the Netherlands. Chapter 2 : Legal Change. Chapter 3: The current Legal Situation. John Griffiths, Alex Blood, Heleen Weyers. 1998.  Amsterdam University Press. https://www.jstor.org/stable/j.ctt46mxn9 --London213 (discuss • contribs) 11:41, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Papers

 * Termination of life on request and Assisted suicide act (Review Procedures) Act in practice - Netherlands Ministry of Foreign Affairs. 2010. Available from : http://www.patientsrightscouncil.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Netherlands_Ministry_of_Justice_FAQ_Euthanasia_2010.pdf --London213 (discuss • contribs) 11:46, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Dutch Criminal Code. Available from : http://www.ejtn.eu/PageFiles/6533/2014%20seminars/Omsenie/WetboekvanStrafrecht_ENG_PV.pdf --London213 (discuss • contribs) 11:42, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * The euthanasia law in Belgium and the Netherlands - Deliens L, Van der Wal G. The euthanasia law in Belgium and the Netherlands [Internet]. The Lanced; 2003 [cited 2020 Nov 29]. Available from: https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(03)14520-5 --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Explaining the emergence of euthanasia law in the Netherlands: how the sociology of law can help the sociology of bioethics - Weyers, H. (2006), Explaining the emergence of euthanasia law in the Netherlands: how the sociology of law can help the sociology of bioethics. Sociology of Health & Illness, 28: 802-816. https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-9566.2006.00543.x --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia in the Netherlands. From Wikipedia. Last edited 31 December 2019. Available at : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euthanasia_in_the_Netherlands --London213 (discuss • contribs) 11:50, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Background about Euthanasia in Netherlands. From Patients Right Council. 2013. Available at : http://www.patientsrightscouncil.org/site/holland-background --London213 (discuss • contribs) 11:53, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Papers
--Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 11: 28, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Attitudes of medical professionals toward euthanasia - James G. Anderson, David P. Caddell, Attitudes of medical professionals toward euthanasia, Social Science & Medicine, Volume 37, Issue 1,1993, Pages 105-114,ISSN 0277-9536,https://doi.org/10.1016/0277-9536(93)90323-V.(http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/027795369390323V) --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Shaw, D., 2007. The body as unwarranted life support: a new perspective on euthanasia. Journal of Medical Ethics, 33(9), pp.519-521., https://jme.bmj.com/content/medethics/33/9/519.full.pdf 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Online Documents
--Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 14:00, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 *  FAQ Euthanasia 2010 : The Termination of Life on Request and Assisted Suicide (Review Procedures) Act in practice - Netherlands Ministry of Foreign Affairs, http://www.patientsrightscouncil.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Netherlands_Ministry_of_Justice_FAQ_Euthanasia_2010.pdf 6 December 2020

Online Research Articles
--Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 15:49, 11 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia: a religious perspective - Vinod Svristarava. US National Library of Medecine National Institutes of Health, https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4158780/ 11 december 2020

Books
--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 20:22, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Book: Donnellan, C. & Smiley, S., 2005. The ethics of euthanasia / editor Craig Donnellan, Cambridge: Independence.

Papers
--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 20:22, 29 November 2020 (UTC) Available at: https://scholarship.richmond.edu/jolpi/vol3/iss1/6--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 22:16, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia: moral paradoxes - H A M J ten Have. (n.d.). Euthanasia: Moral paradoxes - H A M J ten Have, 2001. Retrieved November 29, 2020, from https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1191/026921601682554003 --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia: Historical, Ethical, and Empiric Perspectives - Emanuel EJ. Euthanasia: Historical, Ethical, and Empiric Perspectives. Arch Intern Med. 1994;154(17):1890–1901. doi:10.1001/archinte.1994.00420170022003 --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia, ethics, and the Gordian Knot-McEvoy, P. (2015). Euthanasia, ethics, and the Gordian Knot: is the Hippocratic Code obsolete? The British Journal of General Practice, [online] 65(641), pp.624–625. Available at: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4655711/.
 * Bernadette Spina, Ethical Justifications for Voluntary Active Euthanasia, 3 Rich. J.L. & Pub. Int. 71 (1998).

Papers

 * The medical practice of euthanasia in Belgium and The Netherlands: Legal notification, control and evaluation procedures - Tinne Smets, Johan Bilsen, Joachim Cohen, Mette L. Rurup, Els De Keyser, Luc Deliens, The medical practice of euthanasia in Belgium and The Netherlands: Legal notification, control and evaluation procedures, Health Policy, Volume 90, Issues 2–3, 2009, Pages 181-187, ISSN 0168-8510, https://doi.org/10.1016/j.healthpol.2008.10.003. (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0168851008002248)--Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia: Why people want to die earlier - Clive Seale, Julia Addington-Hall, Euthanasia: Why people want to die earlier, Social Science & Medicine, Volume 39, Issue 5, 1994, Pages 647-654,ISSN 0277-9536, https://doi.org/10.1016/0277-9536(94)90021-3. (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0277953694900213) --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Two Decades of Research on Euthanasia from the Netherlands. What Have We Learnt and What Questions Remain? - Rietjens, J.A.C., van der Maas, P.J., Onwuteaka-Philipsen, B.D. et al. Two Decades of Research on Euthanasia from the Netherlands. What Have We Learnt and What Questions Remain?. Bioethical Inquiry 6, 271–283 (2009). https://doi.org/10.1007/s11673-009-9172-3 --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia in the Netherlands - Wal, G., &amp; Dillmann, R. (1994, May 21). Euthanasia in the Netherlands. Retrieved November 29, 2020, from https://www.bmj.com/content/308/6940/1346.short --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia in Belgium and the Netherlands On a Slippery Slope? - Lerner BH, Caplan AL. Euthanasia in Belgium and the Netherlands: On a Slippery Slope? JAMA Intern Med. 2015;175(10):1640–1641. doi:10.1001/jamainternmed.2015.4086 --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Euthanasia: moral paradoxes  https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1191/026921601682554003--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 20:23, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Not to forget to mention
Quote from "Euthanasia, ethics and the Gordian Knot: is the Hippocratic Code obsolete?", British Journal of General Practice,Patrick McEnvoy (December 2015) "Making an action lawful does not automatically make it ethical." (Mc Envoy, 2015: 625)--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 22:00, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

13.12.2020 (zoom)
meeting notes:
 * date for our final submission: 12 PM UK time 14.12.2020
 * we need to check references
 * medical paragraph needs to be shortened and focus a little bit more on truth and how it is obtained in the discipline
 * we need to make sure that the word count is below 1200
 * the document should be pre-downloaded and checked how it looks as a PDF format
 * checking for consistency in British spelling is important
 * proofreading !!!

attendance: Qenalcu, Grammaloretoo, Arielallin1pods, London213

07.12.2020
meeting notes:
 * Grammaloretoo - references on the last day
 * Uclqena - conclusion
 * link to Wikipedia pages (if possible) --> improves communication and referencing
 * checking of references and used sources
 * discussion on whether truth should be capitalized or in quotation marks? what about euthanasia ? solution: small letter, no quotation (first sentence is an exception)
 * need to check if the text consistently uses American or British spelling - should be changed to British
 * as in the "law" part, every section should start with how truth is defined in this discipline and what does it mean to this discipline

attendance: Qenalcu, Grammaloretoo, Arielallin1pods, London213

30.11.2020 (zoom)

 * solving issues with formatting, citation, and signing
 * the idea for a new order of the perspectives was introduced: Medicine, Law & Ethics —> better flow & the previous chapters can foreshadow the next ones
 * suggested implications of our research: How society tries to construct the life of the elderly? If everyone uses euthanasia, everyone is going to use. Suffering is a part of life. The truth to suffering and death.

Suggested last part: Interdisciplinary euthanasia paradox
 * Response to medical technology
 * Emerged to give freedom to people - moral & ethical reasons
 * Now limited by law and can abuse the power
 * Does it limit the future medical advance and technology?

attendance: Qenalcu, Grammaloretoo, Arielallin1pods, London213

25.11.2020 (zoom)

 * we need to remember about images
 * before we start writing, we should fully understand the grading criteria
 * later, maybe we will be able to find links/bridges/contrast between perspectives
 * we need to remember about the issue of "truth" and how it is created/established in Euthanasia
 * we decided to narrow our research to the issue of Euthanasia in the Netherlands - the first country to legalize it

attendance: Qenalcu, Grammaloretoo, Arielallin1pods, London213

20.11.2020 (zoom)

 * Euthanasia - international law, science, ethics ( illegal vs legal)
 * we need to remember about different truths, different approaches, holistic approach

attendance: Qenalcu, Grammaloretoo, Arielallin1pods, London213

General discussions
Hi guys! I just wanted to share this useful website about the different laws on euthanasia in the Netherlands! Might be useful for you London213! http://www.patientsrightscouncil.org/site/holland-background/ Hope it helps! --Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 13:29, 27 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi! Thank you, I will definitely check it out :)--London213 (discuss • contribs) 11: 28, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! This might be an interesting document for the medical part of the chapter, and might be useful for Arielallin1pods. "Clinical problems with the performance of euthanasia and physician-assisted suicide in the Netherlands" https://search-proquest-com.libproxy.ucl.ac.uk/docview/223932584/fulltextPDF/DA50B58CF8604591PQ/1?accountid=14511 --London213 (discuss • contribs) 13: 00, 28 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! This time a research paper that has some interesting historic background for Grammaloretoo for the introduction if you'd like! ten Have, H.A.M.J. (2001). Euthanasia: moral paradoxes. Palliative Medicine, 15(6), pp.505–511. I'm using this paper a lot for ethics and they have really interesting informations and arguments on euthanasia in the Netherlands! Hope it helps!--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 22:17, 29 November 2020 (UTC) Thank you! I will take a look. Also, I have found some sources that can be useful for ethics, medicine and law. Some of them introduce an interdisciplinary point of view! For example, how the law helps sociology and bioethics or how empirical data affects ethics! --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 18:27, 29 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! I found a question/ answer document about some aspects about euthanasia in Netherlands, and thought it was interesting, if you guys want to check it out ! http://www.patientsrightscouncil.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Netherlands_Ministry_of_Justice_FAQ_Euthanasia_2010.pdf --London213 (discuss • contribs) 11:34, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Thanks I will take a look at it before finalising my paragraph! --Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 11:58, 30 November 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! I just re-read the paragraph on law. I think that maybe we could try to link it more to the "truth theme" as we saw from the last seminar that the best wiki-chapters from last year were the ones that were clear and straight to the facts! Tell me what you think! I will also format my part of the project so that we can discuss it the next time we meet!--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 11:30, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I can definitely rework on it ! :) --London213 (discuss • contribs) 15: 39, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I found a good paradox we could talk about in the interdisciplinary section if we still have words left and if you think it's relevant! "the commitment to a good death created the euthanasia debate while commitment to euthanasia has reduced the number of options available for ensuring the good death." We already talked a bit about it during our last zoom but I think it is worth the explanation ! Tell me what you think :) --Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 11:09, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I really like the paradox that you found and I think it is something important that we could add ! --London213 (discuss • contribs) 14: 23, 3 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! Just found this article that gives a new perspective about euthanasia in Netherlands. I only though that euthanasia was allowed for terminally ill patients that unbearable physical suffering. Actually, it is also allowed for non-terminally ill patients that have a 'psycological suffering that cannot be alleviated". We should look up and analyze how ethics, law and medecine differently assess if a psychiatric patient is eligible for euthanasia! Here is the link to the article I found : https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5623879/ --Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 14: 42, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Also, I'm currently working on a draft for the medecine aspect on euthanasia, but I have many points to cover and I'm not sure if I will have enough space to talk about the different types of euthanasia, how medecine clashes with ethics and law, and talk about the article "the body as an unwarranted type of life support". Which of the three points should I emphasize the most? --Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 15: 03, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

I took the liberty to rephrase some sentences in the introduction and the second paragraph! tell me if you think its better. --Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 19: 33, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! Thank you for the correction of the introduction. I read through it, divided into subtopics and shortened. I hope it looks better now!. Moreover, I counted the words and it looks like we will be over the limit. Tomorrow I am going to read through the law & ethics part and create the "tensions" section. I am going to base it on what we discussed during our last meeting and your separate contributions. --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 05:20, 4 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! Do you think it would be interesting to add a graphic image/ chart that could maybe either illustrate the evolution of the number of deaths because of Euthanasia in contrast with "natural death" in the Netherlands or in contrasting with other countries, or something else. Tell me what you think! :) --London213 (discuss • contribs) 15: 59, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! Yes I found a graph showing the increasing number of deaths due to euthanasia in the Netherlands. Let me insert it in the chapter and let me know if it is useful. --Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 17: 57, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! Good idea! Maybe we could make a graph ourselves? That would be a useful contribution to Wikimedia! --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 21:33, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi again! I put some corrections in the "Law" section. I inserted it underneath the text, so the author can review the changes and hopefully agree with them. Moreover, I added a few sentences about "truths" to link it with the interdisciplinary conclusion. However, you cite a lot from the Dutch Penal Code. I was wondering if we could shorten it and paraphrase. We really need to cut down on words. Finally, thank you for your contribution! I think that the last paragraph is really good and brings up an important idea, perfectly foreshadowing medical part. --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 23:36, 6 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi again! I read through the next part, "ethics". I think the ethical perspective is introduced in a very communicative way. I shortened some parts that were not that relevant to "truth" within euthanasia. I added some parts about the "truth", where I thought it was worth mentioning. I suggest deleting the ending from the “ethics” part because it will be more applicable to the conclusion. I hope that my contribution is relevant, let me know!--Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 01:07, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! Thank you! I will take a look at it! However, I think there are essential parts that need to stay even though it's not that relevant to truth because if we remove them, the readers might be lost. What do you think?Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 10:06, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi again! I corrected the "medical" part as much as I could. This part needs to be shortened by the author. I added at the end more aspects about "truth" and psychiatry perspective, which are very important. --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 01:42, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I really like the idea of making ourself a graph, as we could combine multiple statistical data. I also don't mind doing it. Let me know what you guys think :) --London213 (discuss • contribs) 10: 44, 7 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I just added the sources for the paragraph on ethics. I also corrected one mistake in the law paragraph and counted the words so the word count should be correct for ethics and law! I can't reduce more the paragraph on ethics, i am sorry! --Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 11:55, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! Do not worry, it is okay. If we reduce the conclusion/tensions part and medicine should be fine!--Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 12:29, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! Does anyone know how to move the "pending changes" so that we can see what will be the final edit in "read"? --Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 10:19, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi, I just finished referecing the medecine paragraph! I have read the rest of the chapter and I think it blends in well with the rest of the content; tell me what you think about it! --Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 10: 57, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi, I don't know how to move the pending changes, we should maybe ask how to do it? --London213 (discuss • contribs) 12: 50, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! The medical paragraph fits perfectly with the rest and I now see the link with truth so it's really good! Well done! As for the pending changes, I will take a look again at the wiki videos we needed to watch at the beginning of the year to try to see if there is something that might help us!--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 21:57, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi guys! It seems our issue about the pending changes has been resolved! I will look at the conclusion and see if it changes again as last draft but I think the problem is solved! Do we have a meeting today?--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 12:06, 11 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi, I think the meeting is on the 13th. We also still need to shorten some parts, I read it all again and love how everything ties with each other--London213 (discuss • contribs) 12: 11, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi, again -I think since we need to shorten our chapter, the last part ( last two sentences, starting with "Finally") on Tensions between Disciplines can be in my opinion removed, I don't think it adds something new. Let me know what do you guys think / Also I have had a hard time finding good data to be able and create our own graph, and I am scared that the information that I found is not reliable, and therefore can be misleading. Nevertheless, I still found a graph that was published by the BBC which illustrates euthanasia cases in the Netherlands from 2002 to 2017. Should we include it or not? Does it add something to our chapter? Let me know what you guys think :)--London213 (discuss • contribs) 12: 20, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! As we mentioned in the chat, we will have our last meeting tomorrow (13.12.2020) at 12pm UK time. We can talk about the final changes and shortening paragraphs. Thank you @London213 for the feedback on the "tensions" part. I will try to make it shorter! Moreover, I feel like we could state more clearly the terms connected to "truth" like pluralist, positivism, constructivism etc. Finally, do not worry about the graph. We could add the BBC one, but if it does not work, then we can send it without it. Maybe we could try to find a photo of J.H van den Berg or cover of his book in order to make his statements more credible?--Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 22:50, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I have one more thing that we could change. I feel like we can reduce the use of questions in a medical and ethical paragraph. They are great and bring a lot to the table, but maybe we could rephrase them? This is only because Wikibooks writing style is very simple and formal, but the questions seem rather poetic? Let me know what you think and if this is a relevant comment. --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 22:53, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi again! I just cut down to around 1350 words!!! I am going to read through every part once again and find possible places to shorten the text. I listened to your suggestions, and I agree, that the last sentence of the "tensions" paragraph was an assumption and exaggeration. I made sure to get rid of filler words but if you see some, feel free to delete them! Moreover, I am going to make the final check of the references tomorrow after our meeting, when all of the sources are in. --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 01:57, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi, I just read the new Tension between disciplines new paragraph, and I honestly really like it. I think it is a lot clearer, precise, and concise and really enjoyed ready it. I think you did a very good job with this paragraph and really highlighting the existing tensions between the disciplines related to our subject, and you were also able to cut down some words which is great! I also really enjoyed the use of the terms such as pluralist, positivism, constructivism, I thought they were really well used! :)--London213 (discuss • contribs) 11: 25, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I agree for the tensions between disciplines new paragraph! It is way more clearer and "straight to the point" than before! If we need to reduce the word count again, I can definitely recheck everything to remove more words!--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 11:57, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I changed again the medecine paragraph as it was not linked enough to the notion of truth. --Arielallin1pods (discuss • contribs) 21: 16, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I think that the medicine part is great right now! I really like the idea of multilateral truth. Moreover, I managed to shorter everything to around 1194. Please, make sure to read it one more time in the morning before our submission at 12pm! --Grammaloretoo (discuss • contribs) 01:43, 14 December 2020 (UTC)

Hi! I just re-read everything and it is very good. I think we managed to fit in all our ideas. There are still the pending reviews,I will see how to remove them. Hopefully they will be accepted before we download the wikibook.--Qenalcu (discuss • contribs) 10:01, 14 December 2020 (UTC)